Interview by George Sandifer-Smith
Some people like to articulate why things are good or bad, but I don’t think it is as fun as writing or reading poetry, so I’ll leave that to people with grand ideas/ more time/ on their / hands
i’m still looking for the perfect lover
for julia
it’s like when you’re on you’re completely on
running for the door
pissing for the camera
new york is not as young as she was & besides
life can be pretty unbearable
but who cares for the dingy passages of the subway
when we can throw all the wine glasses in washington heights
from the window to the wall
& feel like
favourite records on swing sets
lovers tonguing in a foreign language
charlie charms & poems
wait a sec
julia
you may never become the painter you dreamt of becoming
but somewhere a lonely boy is picking apples
beneath the beautiful lights of the lower east side
& you see yourself
the moment you tense for the sweetness of the apple
an ocean baptises a new ocean
one drink
two drinks
hallelujah!
How important is it to you as a poet to connect the classical to the present day?
Maybe a 6 out of 10. I think what I enjoy is disparate images. So if a poem features the emperor Nero drinking a latte with Selina Gomez in Starbucks so much the better. Then again if you’ve got Nero drinking in Cafe Nero I think you’ve maybe overcooked it.
Scratching a teeny bit deeper, being a poet you might have some kind of idea of a tradition, or see yourself as a small part of something awe-inspiring. In many ways, it is comforting to me that others have suffered and written and suffered and written and suffered and written. But is it really important to me to connect the past and present? Not too often. My ambition in writing is to meet Taylor Swift. I haven’t given up on that.
‘wait a sec/julia/you may never become the painter you dreamt of becoming’ The loose form of the poem creates a tone that is almost conversational – how do you decide where the line break is?
I don’t really have much to add to the great baulk of knowledge we already have on line breaks. I think, like with the rest of poetry, you should listen to Frank O’Hara and ‘go on your nerve’ – if it works it works, your job is merely to notice that it works. Some people like to articulate why things are good or bad, but I don’t think it is as fun as writing or reading poetry, so I’ll leave that to people with grand ideas/ more time/ on their / hands. I would also argue that the line you pulled out is conversational because of the language I use, not the form, ‘wait a sec’ is clearly culled from everyday speech – it might also be an attempt to slow the poem down.
Having said that, one thing I do pay close attention to is playing with short/long lines. I think I got this trick from Hera Lindsay Bird, but, and this echoes your first question, I’m pretty sure you could trace it back to a Sappho fragment. Fundamentally I think the most important thing in a poem is engaging the reader, jazzy line breaks are a part of the craft, but not everything….unfortunately if I tell you any more, I’d have to kill you!
the moment you tense for the sweetness of the apple/an ocean baptises a new ocean’ This reader felt the weight of a single moment drawn out in these lines – do you find yourself expanding on smaller moments often in your work?
Thanks! First of all I’d like to treat you to a little background. ‘i’m still looking for the perfect lover’ was inspired by the Noah Baumbach film ‘Frances Ha!’ A film about a dancer who tries to make it in New York. Somewhere along the poem’s path to publication Ella Frears told me I should write more poems for my girlfriend, so I decided to swap Frances Ha for my girlfriend Julia.
I tend to think of poems, or at least try to think of poems, especially longer ones, in the mindset of a film director. Imagine you are Andrea Arnold directing a poem! Imagine you are Christopher Nolan directing a poem! Film, like poetry, is made up of these smaller moments of heightened tension, as well as other things. So yes, you’re right, I do try to zoom in on smaller moments, as well as other techniques I picked up from a misspent youth hanging around Broadway cinema in Nottingham.
Before I go, I’ll bless you with a short list of poets whose work has excellent cinematography: Wallace Stevens, Rebecca Tamás, August Kleinzahler, Sophie Collins, Mark Waldron, Luke Kennard, Benjamin Prado, Manuel Vilas, Vahni Anthony Ezekiel Capildeo. The New York School, Homer, Elizabeth Bishop, Rainer Maria Rilke, Warsan Shire, Federico Garcia Lorca and many, many others whose names escape me. Read them all carefully and all the glittering secrets of life will tumble out before your very eyes.